Ogbene is out for a minimum of 6 weeks another hamstring, it is not bad luck it is down to training, diet and medical team. Arsenal had this issue a few years back and they had to change the whole training system and the medical team. Warne was a fitness coach but our players arent fit, they are not mentally strong and Warne admits openly on the radio that he has no idea how to deal with it.
Deary deary me agree what ever happened at the Germany trip. Questions have to be asked players injured they don't look fit no confidence from where I am sitting things are looking bleak. We should have made the change last spring it's not working I can't see the situation going on for much longer talking to a few millers the worm has turned. I can't only see another bad day at the office this Saturday for Mr Warne his days are numbered.
-- Edited by TH MILLER on Monday 9th of September 2019 12:07:36 PM
Ogbene injured his hamstring a day or two after he signed for us. We must have done something very drastic to his diet and training programme. No doubt there was a nutritional issue behind Clarke colliding with our own keeper on the very day he signed, and perhaps we need to work on Morris's eyesight to.prevent him clashing heads and getting concussed. Why do there always have to be fingers pointed and blame thrown around? I've seen the fitness regime at the club first hand and it is incredibly sophisticated, but injuries can still happen despite all best efforts and you can have periods of bad luck.
Can I blame PW for the train delays that I experienced for the Tranmere game? I don't see why not. He seems to be held responsible for everything apart from when we win!
Smiler sophisticated doesnt mean good, check a dictionary. Pw is accountable for the results good or bad he will get credit when things go well and blame when they don't. I have already said i think the recruitment is good so credit to warne, his handling of purrington was awful and we now do not have a left back that wants to be at the club. We are not winning games and we look unfit and one dimensional, instead of having ago at fellow fans defend your man.......we wait
One season as manager in League One, one promotion. Why....that's almost a 100% success rate. And we hardly pulled up any trees at the beginning of the promotion season, although I have no doubt that you would have been calling for him to be sacked at that time.
Thanks for the unnecessary English lesson Derby. Sophisticated doesn't always equal good but in our case it does. The players get top medical monitoring and care. The point I'm obviously making - and which you haven't addressed - is that it is way over the top to blame our manager for the hamstring injury sustained by a player who had only joined us two days earlier on the basis of poor diet and medical care. Have a go at Brentfords training regime maybe but how is that our fault? The other point I'm making - which you also haven't addressed - is that it is hardly the managers fault that a player gets concussed in a clash of heads or that a new signing got clobbered by our own keeper on day one. Those injuries could happen to any player at any time and it is plain unlucky that they have all happened to our players in the first few weeks of the season. Or do you not think so? As usual I dont mind fair criticism of anyone but you do seem very keen to blame Warne and Barker for anything and everything given half a chance. That is unfortunate because the decent points you make get a bit lost in your maelstrom (meaning 'state of violent turmoil'). Are you sure there wasn't something about the way Barker batted at Wickersley CC that cost us the Ashes?
Smiler we come from two opposing sides however let me try again, you still have done little to defend warne and barker except ask me and others to justify our points. However i accept that you make a good point about the 3 injuries. My overall point is we seem to be getting quite a few injuries and it is a concern, remember vassells was because he pulled out of a tackle our manager has stated that their is a mental strength issue in the squad, i suggest that the mind not believing in themselves will impact the players in terms of injuries and recovery, warne has already questioned jones slow recovery. I believe there is an issue there, you clearly do not, we have no way of proving it one way or the other. Regarding blaming warne and barker, of course they have full control of all on the pitch matters at the club, if the team are not performing they are accountable, if you think they are not accountable please tell us who is?
Of course the management team have responsibilities and are accountable. That goes without saying.
I couldnt give a monkey's about cup games. The league is all that really matters. We have won two, drawn one and lost two. Not great but not dreadful. We haven't found any fluidity yet. We have chopped and changed looking for the right combinations but our hand has been forced a bit. All three substitutions on Saturday were forced. Hastie was cramping up having not played a competitive game, Morris had only played two minutes in three to four weeks so was blowing a bit and MacDonald took a knock. Not excuses, but an example of how these things can compound. Players get injured, others come in who aren't match fit, someone else picks up a knock, someone else gets forced to play while carrying a knock or before they are ready etc etc.
It's been a messy, disjointed start to the season in almost every way with us having to play a meaningless game we wished didn't exist on one hand but having two league games postponed on the other, and a series of freaky injuries. Not excuses, but it has all been very stop/start and we just haven't got going. All very frustrating.
My belief is that we have good players, a Chairman who wants us to do well and a management team who got us promoted last time we were in this division. They should be given the opportunity to get it right. I accept we are in a rough patch at the moment. That can happen in football. But it is ludicrous in my opinion to start screaming and shouting five games into the season when we have seven points on the board. I don't think that getting on their backs at this stage of proceedings is in any way helpful.
Sadly it is the way of things these days. Every manager is probably three bad results/performances from the risk of the sack. Supporters tend to think they know everything and they are quick to put Boards under pressure to make hasty decisions. That is true at every club and it is certainly true at ours. I accept that is the reality no matter how much I dislike it.
If I understand you correctly Derby you are saying that due to poor management we are mentally weak, and that as a result of that the players are picking up injuries or not recovering from them either consciously or unconsciously. If I have that right it is an interesting theory, but one based entirely on assumption, supposition and conjecture. It smacks to me of someone putting two and two together and coming up with five. I prefer to think that it is what it appears to be - a run of bad luck.
-- Edited by smiler on Monday 9th of September 2019 11:25:53 PM
Smiler when is this run of bad luck going to change we haven't won at home since April against Notts Forrest. I will tell you when it will end when we fetch a new manager in.
Somebody tell me how we've got recruitment right since start of last season. No 1st choice left back who wants to play. No holding midfielder. Smith still only striker we have good enough when he's played up front.
TH Miller, I'm not blaming everything on bad luck. Read more carefully. Derby has a theory about injuries being caused by bad management. I'm saying we have had some bad luck with injuries which definitely hasn't helped. I'm saying that it is very harsh to blame the manager for a collection of freak injuries to new signings. There are clearly other things to sort out as well, but there it is. Is that clear enough?
smiler at last we are getting somewhere.
You make a very good point about cancelled games and the silly man utd game, none of that helps.
I do not agree with you about cup games not counting, all games have an importance in some way, you can not rule out 3 games just because they make the stats look worse!!. The cup games matter for a few reasons
1. They allow the management team to play fringe players to create competition for places
2. They allow the management team to try different tactics and formations
3. The allow the management team to play young developing players to get them a feel for being around the first team
4. They allow the fans to see more of the team, after all that is the main reason for existing as a club
5. Confidence - Doing well in the cup breeds confidence or destroys confidence. Example Watfords start this season following being hammered in the cup final. Us at Burton, a good performance on the back of a 4-0 away cup win.
I am a Masters student studying Psychology, so I do have some knowledge on the mind and the impact on peoples behaviour, my comments are therefore not speculation. I also specialise on leadership especially when dealing with generation-Y and Generation-Z followers. Sports people are massively impacted by the mind, their performance and results hugely impacted by it. When the leader that you follow demonstrates themselves to be worried, to talk about not being around long, to state that there are issues he doesn't know what to do to resolve, that feeds into the minds of his followers. So my points are this
1. Warne needs some additional help from a experienced footballing individual
2. He does not demonstrate good leadership qualities, the Mr Niceguy is not a sustainable strategy for a leader, he needs to adapt his style but not in a way that confuses his followers.
3. Identifying yourself and that of your coach as a teacher is an awful thing to do, it puts you apart from the group and places you as someone that dictates and lectures the players, this is in direct contradiction to the niceguy approach, it shows he flips from one thing to another. I would love to hear why he thinks that identity is the right one at the moment.
4. We do not play attractive football under PW, I accept that is a matter of opinion, but I am rarely excited by watching his teams.
As for should he be sacked? NO, NO, NO
He has to be given support from his employers and a chance to address the failings of his approach.
Should the team and him be supported on match days? YES, YES, YES
Does the squad need some time to settle and a chance to gel? YES, YES, YES how long will be determined by the owners and our league position.
Can he sort this on his own without help? I DO NOT THINK HE CAN
Do I want us to hammer Bolton and start to perform and get the right results? OF COURSE
Warney he's just a cheap option. Never been a manager. He won't rock the boat for the chairman. Coming home to roost now his time as manager here. He's at the helm nobody else to blame.
Well 5 games into the season, and we are already DOOMED, the man in charge can’t manage a headache, the players brought in are charlatans, never been footballers, and the copy and paste usage on this site is in overdrive!!!! Wow what a season we have to look forward to. Let’s sack the manager, clear out the deadwood we have obviously recruited, along with the deadwood still present, and get another messiah in. Oh wait, transfer deadline shut, no players in or out, could always cancel a few contracts I suppose?? We might just get lucky with appointing someone willing to work with another’s inferior recruited staff, or recruit from the released list where there is a whole feast of players waiting for that last golden ticket to see out their career. Then there is the small matter of the cost doing this! After so little recruitment last season, I’m surprised at the level of recruitment this season. Will finances stretch further to allow the amount of change being asked for, its only someone else’s money, but wait, Bury and Bolton are shining examples of the consequences of not living within their means. It’s been a disappointing start to the season, there is no getting away from that fact, but let things settle and bed in. Come Christmas and there’s no improvement, then the copy and paste brigade just might have a case.
gwru you are great, I am a mature student I have 30+ years managing and running teams, large and small and across the globe. You are a professional wind-up merchant and it works with glen and Brad etc but not with me. I prefer to have a sensible discussion about the team and the club.
smiler at last we are getting somewhere. You make a very good point about cancelled games and the silly man utd game, none of that helps. I do not agree with you about cup games not counting, all games have an importance in some way, you can not rule out 3 games just because they make the stats look worse!!. The cup games matter for a few reasons 1. They allow the management team to play fringe players to create competition for places 2. They allow the management team to try different tactics and formations 3. The allow the management team to play young developing players to get them a feel for being around the first team 4. They allow the fans to see more of the team, after all that is the main reason for existing as a club 5. Confidence - Doing well in the cup breeds confidence or destroys confidence. Example Watfords start this season following being hammered in the cup final. Us at Burton, a good performance on the back of a 4-0 away cup win.
I am a Masters student studying Psychology, so I do have some knowledge on the mind and the impact on peoples behaviour, my comments are therefore not speculation. I also specialise on leadership especially when dealing with generation-Y and Generation-Z followers. Sports people are massively impacted by the mind, their performance and results hugely impacted by it. When the leader that you follow demonstrates themselves to be worried, to talk about not being around long, to state that there are issues he doesn't know what to do to resolve, that feeds into the minds of his followers. So my points are this
1. Warne needs some additional help from a experienced footballing individual 2. He does not demonstrate good leadership qualities, the Mr Niceguy is not a sustainable strategy for a leader, he needs to adapt his style but not in a way that confuses his followers. 3. Identifying yourself and that of your coach as a teacher is an awful thing to do, it puts you apart from the group and places you as someone that dictates and lectures the players, this is in direct contradiction to the niceguy approach, it shows he flips from one thing to another. I would love to hear why he thinks that identity is the right one at the moment. 4. We do not play attractive football under PW, I accept that is a matter of opinion, but I am rarely excited by watching his teams.
As for should he be sacked? NO, NO, NO He has to be given support from his employers and a chance to address the failings of his approach. Should the team and him be supported on match days? YES, YES, YES Does the squad need some time to settle and a chance to gel? YES, YES, YES how long will be determined by the owners and our league position. Can he sort this on his own without help? I DO NOT THINK HE CAN Do I want us to hammer Bolton and start to perform and get the right results? OF COURSE
Derby, that post explains an awful lot and puts your other posts in a much clearer context.
Three quick points if I may:-
1. I am not ignoring the cup games to suit the stats. I was never bothered about them and said so before each and every one of them. I object to the playing Man Utd U21's as a matter of principle and that competition is a joke. The Carabao Cup isn't much better. We picked up injuries in at least two of those games that we could have done without.
2. If Warne had been stronger in his public pronouncements the players wouldn't have picked up so many injuries? A working theory based on a little bit of knowledge is always a dangerous thing. I won't bother, but I could give you theories just as viable that would point to the opposite conclusion. The truth is that you don't know any more than I do whether those injuries would have occurred under a different leader.
3. Don't patronise me please my friend. You know nothing about me but I can assure you that I don't need you telling me when we are or aren't getting somewhere. For the record, I really don't think we are and having read your post I think we are unlikely to, so I will leave it there.
