I might be an idiot for not wanting to go up but last season was horrible. I think I personally, as a fan, am not ready to go to the stadium every two weeks to watch us lose 4 out of 5 games yet.

Having watched Doncaster and Rochdale outplay us I am leaning towards Brad's theory, that we would be eaten alive. Althought I think there is credance in Derbymiller's statement that we as a club aren't ready.

As for the statement that the higher revenue means we can compete in the championship, yes there is a higher revenue, but higher wages offset that. Making numbers up here, but if the average Championship wage is £10,000 a week then we would pay £5,000. It's basic economics. This means the better players get the better wages at the better clubs.

If you are still arguing the toss about this, food for thought is that if EVERY single game in the championship was a sellout at NYS then we would probably be 22nd of 24 in the championship attendance league table...or thereabouts.

Hard though it is to accept, we are a top of League 1 standard club (and team) or bottom 5 of the championship. That's who we are - for at least this and next season I want us to be top of our division.

Not ambitious but realistic.

I know where you are coming from Bornamiller but I think it is naive to think that there is in fact any solution to the essential problem, which is how does a small town club with a core support of seven or eight thousand people become an established, mid-table or better Championship outfit?

Here is my take on it.

Tony Stewart can't or won't do what Mr Benham at Brentford or the Russian guy at Bournemouth has done and plough several tens of millions in. We scraped fourth from bottom with Evans by stretching the budget to fund a mix of old pros and loanees, and Stewart realised that we couldn't do that year after year. When Evans asked for more and more money he was told it was all gone, which I would guess was the 'difference of opinion' that was cited when Evans went.

Stewart looked again and went for Redfearn on a three year plan, to bring young players through who might become saleable - a way to generate cash that could be reinvested. The Barnsley model if you like. Unfortunately Stewart wanted to have his cake and eat it. He wanted a long term strategy but at the first sign of supporter unhappiness with short term results he pulled the trigger and bankrolled Neil Warnock to revert to Plan A, get some old heads in and scrape survival. I would guess that with the short-term contracts handed out to Best, Doyley, Thomas and others plus Warnocks wages and bonus, that was a big investment.

When we couldn't persuade Warnock to stay (probably because we couldn't maintain the spend longer term), Stewart went back to Plan B and asked Stubbs to do what he had asked Redfearn to do before. As with Redfearn, Stubbs was fired when despite being given a long-term contract he delivered some poor short term results. Again, Stewart panicked when the supporters turned.

When Jackett realised that it was actually a miracle that was expected of him, the Championship game was up. We were adrift and the cupboard was bare. In fact worse than bare - we went into League One with savings having to be made.

A couple of things spring out at me from that.

Firstly, I can't blame Warne at all for any of it, and in fact he has done a terrific job all things considered.

Secondly the supporters are partly to blame for the mess we got into. Like a lot of supporters, they are ultra-quick to turn on any manager when results are poor over a few games. Redfearn in particular was treated disgracefully by the supporters. Stubbs never engaged at all with the supporters so he was in part the architect of his own downfall, but he too was shabbily treated.

Thirdly, Mr Stewart made a rod for his own back. His talk of mid-table-looking-up was never realistic. He failed to manage expectations. He needed to say when employing Redfearn and Stubbs that they were there for the long-term even if we went down. Like Burnley did with Dyche when they bombed out of the Premier League, and look where that has got them. And like Burton are doing now with Clough.

Where does that leave us now? Rebuilding and back where we were three years ago. I think we should try and get up if we can, but if we do go up we (1) shouldn't break the bank trying to stay there and (2) shouldn't panic if we struggle. We probably would struggle up there, because for now at least we just haven't got the clout to spend our way into a mid-table position. But if we go up with a young squad and come down with a year more's experience we might actually be better off in the long term. Without more money from somewhere (investor, commercial revenue or whatever) I don;t see any other option.

None of that alters the fact that on the whole we are much better off for Tony Stewart's involvement and not in a bad place at all, relative to where we were in the dark times a few short years ago.

smiler wrote:

---

I couldn't disagree more about the 'attitude' thing.

Dominic Ball was a bad player for us pure and simple. Nothing to do with attitude. He couldn't get a game at Peterborough and he can't get a game at Aberdeen in a league that is about League 1 standard. His last start for us he was hooked at half time after one of the most embarrassing 45 minutes I can remember seeing in a Millers shirt. He couldn't have trapped a medicine ball that day.

Which of the players Ex listed had a bad attitude? As far as I know Arnason, Revell, Morgan, Frecks, Agard, Skarz etc were absolute model professionals. In fact how many players did Evans drop or ship out or refuse to sign quoting their attitude and one of his favourite sayings about not tolerating 'bad apples'? His teams were founded on team spirit just as much as Warne's team is. Guardiola is rated as the best manager in the world and he doesn't tolerate a bad attitude either. Aguerro was dropped and sidelined until he improved his attitude and work rate despite being one of the best finishers in the world. All this 'Warneys Boys' claptrap is absolute nonsense.

It is a myth that the Evans League 1 side was far better than the current side. That team was associated with two promotions and rightly those players are remembered fondly. But the truth is that most of them couldn't cut it in the Championship. This side is thought of as having players in it that failed in the Championship and having stepped down a division. But in simple terms this team is fourth in League One which is exactly where that team got to and finished. There isn't much to choose between them. It is just a perception gap. And any idea that League 1 four years ago was somehow stronger than it is now is also a myth and perception gap. There were plenty of poor teams in League1 then too. League 1 is what it is - not as good as the Championship but better than League 2.

---

 ye p totally agree with this 

and the comments forde is a warnes fav 

to be honest warne was right about forde up until the rochdale match that given game time he would prove the doubters wrong

 warne has publicly said that if they play bad then they will be dropped

he has had two bad games time to change it and give taylor or williams a start 

vaulks has gone off the boil as well time for palmer to have a go

and i believe warne will make the changes if he doesnt then he makes a rod for his own back

-- Edited by hillsborough miller on Friday 16th of March 2018 08:23:18 AM